Bitcoin as a Secret Weapon: Double Your Earnings & Build Brand Loyalty - Mario D'Elena

Mario D'Elena: 00:00:00

At the beginning, businesses were really reluctant to actually engage with social media.

Mario D'Elena: 00:00:05

But soon enough they understood that it actually doubles their earnings, it doubles their reach.

Mario D'Elena: 00:00:11

And I think the same thing goes for bitcoin.

Josh Friedemann: 00:00:18

Welcome to the Business Bitcoinization show, the show dedicated to helping you enrich your life and grow your business with bitcoin, the hardest money on planet Earth.

Josh Friedemann: 00:00:29

I'm your host, Josh Friedemann, and our guest today is Mario D'Elena.

Josh Friedemann: 00:00:33

He's the head of Relay Business and he helps European business owners put bitcoin on their balance sheets.

Josh Friedemann: 00:00:40

He himself is a small business owner.

Josh Friedemann: 00:00:42

He actually teaches people taekwondo and he holds bitcoin on his balance sheet as well.

Josh Friedemann: 00:00:47

We're going to get to our interview with Mario right after this.

Josh Friedemann: 00:01:08

Mario, welcome to the podcast.

Mario D'Elena: 00:01:10

Thanks, Josh.

Mario D'Elena: 00:01:11

Happy to be here.

Mario D'Elena: 00:01:12

Thanks for the invitation.

Josh Friedemann: 00:01:14

I like to start off every single interview with a few questions that help us to get to know you a little bit better and give us some insight for our own lives.

Josh Friedemann: 00:01:22

Are you ready for these?

Mario D'Elena: 00:01:23

For sure.

Josh Friedemann: 00:01:25

Question number one is this.

Josh Friedemann: 00:01:26

When and how did you first learn about bitcoin?

Mario D'Elena: 00:01:29

Yeah, sure.

Mario D'Elena: 00:01:30

Let's keep it short and simple.

Mario D'Elena: 00:01:33

X account was created in May: 2012

Mario D'Elena: 00:01:42

And I would say rather, luckily I didn't do because I think if I had bought it then I would have just traded it and sold in the next bull run.

Mario D'Elena: 00:01:50

So I'm happy that I kept studying martial arts then and kept focusing on that because now, eight years later, I actually did change my focus and purchased it.

Mario D'Elena: 00:02:04

a second degree black belt in: 2020

Mario D'Elena: 00:02:16

So I'm not only working for Relay Business, I also have a business and use it as a source of wealth.

Mario D'Elena: 00:02:26

I mean, I put it on my balance sheet as well.

Mario D'Elena: 00:02:30

So in: 2020

Mario D'Elena: 00:02:43

And every day I was confronted with the situation of people that want to save for the future.

Mario D'Elena: 00:02:48

So investing was a big theme for me and bitcoin was the best solution.

Josh Friedemann: 00:02:53

I actually had no idea that you were also a small business owner yourself.

Josh Friedemann: 00:02:56

That might factor into some of the questions later in the interview.

Josh Friedemann: 00:03:00

But the second question is, what's an insight or fact about bitcoin that you wish everyone understood I personally think that.

Mario D'Elena: 00:03:07

Bitcoin is a tool for financial abundance.

Mario D'Elena: 00:03:10

And I think a lot of people do understand that.

Mario D'Elena: 00:03:14

So if you look at the performance, let's take my business as an example.

Mario D'Elena: 00:03:19

If I put in a lump sum four years ago, when I started in September, that would have performed 400% by now.

Mario D'Elena: 00:03:26

So I quadrupled everything that I put in.

Mario D'Elena: 00:03:29

But if I also had DCA next to it monthly, I would have just made 100% out of it.

Mario D'Elena: 00:03:37

What does that translate to?

Mario D'Elena: 00:03:38

Because I think most people don't stop and think what that means.

Mario D'Elena: 00:03:43

That translates into having double the students or it translates into having two schools actually and not just one.

Mario D'Elena: 00:03:52

And that's where I would say, take a minute, think about it.

Mario D'Elena: 00:03:57

What it does mean to have double the earnings with no extra expenses.

Mario D'Elena: 00:04:01

And that's the obvious point.

Mario D'Elena: 00:04:03

Now what a lot of people don't get, and I did the post that last week, I think, is that bitcoin is the biggest and most well known brand of the world.

Mario D'Elena: 00:04:12

And after January: 2024

Mario D'Elena: 00:04:21

And now if you decide to put it on your balance sheet, it actually sends a message to the world because bitcoin is open source, it's fast, it's liquid, it's honest, it's proof of work.

Mario D'Elena: 00:04:31

It's absolutely scarce, permissionless, peer to peer and the best store of value.

Mario D'Elena: 00:04:36

And this does say a lot about any enterprise that puts it on the balance sheet.

Mario D'Elena: 00:04:41

It means that you are efficiently working.

Mario D'Elena: 00:04:45

It translates into that you use the best products, for example, you're sustainable, you're transparent, you're innovative and open for everyone.

Mario D'Elena: 00:04:53

So next to being a financial tool, I think it's a big marketing tool.

Mario D'Elena: 00:04:57

So I don't know whether you have seen the post from Patrick Lovri, he's the CEO of Samara Asset Group and they made an announcement that they put bitcoin on their balance sheet and one day later he had 5,000 new followers.

Mario D'Elena: 00:05:13

So what a lot of people don't get is that bitcoin is also actually a marketing solution.

Mario D'Elena: 00:05:20

So if you put bitcoin on the balance sheet and you make it known to the world, every bitcoin will follow you.

Josh Friedemann: 00:05:26

That's a great point.

Josh Friedemann: 00:05:28

Recently, if people spend much time on X, they may have seen probably earlier in the summer there was a business in the US called KC Cattle that announced that they would accept bitcoin and hold it on their balance sheet.

Josh Friedemann: 00:05:40

And same thing, they exploded in growth.

Josh Friedemann: 00:05:43

I think that actually led not just to social media growth, but actual sales as well.

Josh Friedemann: 00:05:49

That point is well taken.

Josh Friedemann: 00:05:51

It's a great marketing tool, but it also helps you to sustain and grow your business more easily and more rapidly.

Josh Friedemann: 00:05:59

I think it'll be good to talk about that a little bit more to understand the trends you're seeing when it comes to Relay business or just as you're talking with other business owners that you know in your area.

Josh Friedemann: 00:06:11

Let's get to question number three right here.

Josh Friedemann: 00:06:13

And that is, what's the bitcoin resource you most recommend to other people?

Mario D'Elena: 00:06:18

So personally, I recommend most often to just read the bitcoin standard and not even the whole book, but just the first four chapters.

Mario D'Elena: 00:06:26

If you understand why in the history of money, money has always failed, then you actually know.

Mario D'Elena: 00:06:32

If you also get the facts of bitcoin right, like the hard cap and difficulty adjustment and all those things, then you understand that it is the solution that humanity has been seeking for eternity.

Mario D'Elena: 00:06:45

So this is the first part and then I of course recommend to just go and listen every possible podcast.

Mario D'Elena: 00:06:53

I'm a big fan of listening to stuff because you can just 1.5 listen to it.

Mario D'Elena: 00:06:58

So Audible and YouTube podcasts or Spotify, wherever you want to get it, but get it with 1.5 speed and you will be working up the history of bitcoin faster than anything is possible.

Josh Friedemann: 00:07:11

Question number four, Beyond Bitcoin, what's a resource, tool or idea that's been helpful to you or your work at Relay recently?

Mario D'Elena: 00:07:19

So we leverage a lot with social media.

Mario D'Elena: 00:07:22

You have probably seen that Relay is really active on social media and I think that's the go to for every business.

Mario D'Elena: 00:07:29

So first of all, get social media right because it doubles your earnings, it doubles your reach.

Mario D'Elena: 00:07:35

And then get the bitcoin thing right, put it on your balance sheet and it doubles again.

Mario D'Elena: 00:07:40

So this is my recommendation to use social media at your best.

Josh Friedemann: 00:07:44

And I don't know how much you're involved in the social media side.

Josh Friedemann: 00:07:48

I know a lot of businesses struggle with how to create content that engages people that feels real instead of sort of, I don't know, I guess too stiff.

Josh Friedemann: 00:07:58

Do you have any recommendations, like whether it's things that you post for Relay or just things that you see that perform well from your end recommendations to business owners about how to use social media more effectively.

Mario D'Elena: 00:08:10

So we have the luck that we have great people that do that for us.

Mario D'Elena: 00:08:14

So that's why I can use their knowledge, but I'm not knowledgeable enough to actually tell you what to do for sure is that your face must be known.

Mario D'Elena: 00:08:26

So just make everyone know that you are the guy that does this at the business and use all the people that you know to leverage it.

Mario D'Elena: 00:08:38

So ask everyone to just give you a like and to share what you're posting.

Josh Friedemann: 00:08:44

Now we have our final, what we call our arbitrary but insightful question and it's this.

Josh Friedemann: 00:08:50

As a general life principle, is it better to ask why or why not?

Mario D'Elena: 00:08:55

It's a good question and of course hard to answer.

Mario D'Elena: 00:08:59

I think there's no right answer.

Mario D'Elena: 00:09:00

But I have three children and they always ask me why and tell them why not.

Mario D'Elena: 00:09:05

Only if they are not allowed to do something, they ask me why not.

Mario D'Elena: 00:09:08

That's not so often.

Mario D'Elena: 00:09:10

So I would say I would stick with why.

Josh Friedemann: 00:11:19

So, Mario, we're here today to talk about Relay Business.

Josh Friedemann: 00:11:23

It's been over a year, I think maybe even pushing a year and a half since I've talked to anyone at Relay.

Josh Friedemann: 00:11:28

I'm sure there's a lot of things that have happened since then.

Josh Friedemann: 00:11:31

But if you would just start off by sharing what Relay Business is, the primary types of businesses that you look to serve and I guess we'll go from there.

Josh Friedemann: 00:11:41

How about that?

Josh Friedemann: 00:11:41

So some of the businesses that Relay is working for and really what the purpose of Relay Business is.

Mario D'Elena: 00:11:46

Yes.

Mario D'Elena: 00:11:47

So we grant easy access to Bitcoin for small and mid sized enterprises.

Mario D'Elena: 00:11:51

What this means is that we offer an onboarding in 48 hours you can be on board with us and start stacking sets.

Mario D'Elena: 00:11:59

And we do this for low fees and want to keep it as simple as possible.

Mario D'Elena: 00:12:03

We are non custodian, so everything is self custody.

Mario D'Elena: 00:12:07

We never hold any assets of our clients.

Mario D'Elena: 00:12:11

And on top of that you have also a person that is there for you if you have any needs.

Mario D'Elena: 00:12:16

So you can call me or other people from the Relay private business department and have a direct contact all, all time.

Mario D'Elena: 00:12:24

So they have our numbers, they can call us even at night, whenever they feel like we are reachable.

Josh Friedemann: 00:12:29

And when it comes to who you serve, is it all of Europe?

Josh Friedemann: 00:12:33

Are there certain countries in Europe that you serve and is there a possibility to go even beyond Europe?

Mario D'Elena: 00:12:39

Yeah, we serve all of Europe.

Mario D'Elena: 00:12:41

We cannot actively market right now in Europe, but we are looking to get the French license.

Mario D'Elena: 00:12:46

And starting from January we are planning to be the only, the only bitcoin only enterprise that has the M license.

Mario D'Elena: 00:12:55

So then we can actively market the whole of Europe.

Josh Friedemann: 00:12:58

And then as far as the types of businesses you said small to medium sized enterprises, when it comes to those businesses do you see any trends in the types of businesses that are interested in relay business?

Josh Friedemann: 00:13:14

And then do they tend to buy chunks of bitcoin at a time or is it more that dollar cost averaging strategy that a lot of individual bitcoiners tend to use as well?

Mario D'Elena: 00:13:24

So we have all sorts of businesses.

Mario D'Elena: 00:13:26

So it's the trend that I see is that always one of the board's member or leadership team is a deep down bitcoiner.

Mario D'Elena: 00:13:35

So one person got all the facts already right.

Mario D'Elena: 00:13:39

So we don't have to do that much of education still some with the others, but not always the whole education.

Mario D'Elena: 00:13:46

And we see crafts and trades, enterprises, we see service and consulting, but also real estate.

Mario D'Elena: 00:13:52

We have gold bugs that buy with us.

Mario D'Elena: 00:13:55

So we have really all sorts of businesses.

Mario D'Elena: 00:13:57

And that's the interesting part because everyone has understood that at least 1 to 5% is something that you should put on your balance sheet.

Josh Friedemann: 00:14:05

And is that 1 to 5%, that's sort of the typical range that you see for a lot of businesses?

Mario D'Elena: 00:14:10

I would say.

Mario D'Elena: 00:14:11

I would say that's the typical range.

Mario D'Elena: 00:14:13

So with us you can only put earnings into the balance sheet.

Mario D'Elena: 00:14:18

So it's important that it's in operation.

Mario D'Elena: 00:14:21

The business must be operational and the earnings can be put into bitcoin.

Mario D'Elena: 00:14:26

And therefore, I'd say yeah, 1 to 5% is what we see right now.

Mario D'Elena: 00:14:30

It's also the message that is out there from blackrock, which of course is a huge influence in this part.

Mario D'Elena: 00:14:38

So I have yet to see a business that has the 100% or the maxi.

Mario D'Elena: 00:14:43

The maxi philosophy.

Mario D'Elena: 00:14:44

Right.

Josh Friedemann: 00:14:45

So I guess another thing is you mentioned that there is the common denominator is that there's always some board member, maybe an executive team member who understands bitcoin very well.

Josh Friedemann: 00:14:56

Is that usually the person that reaches out to relay or do they kind of already rally the troops and then kind of send it to the top before whoever the CEO or president or whoever else says someone reach out to relay for us, how does it tend to work?

Josh Friedemann: 00:15:14

I guess really the reason I'm asking the question is for people listening to be thinking for themselves.

Josh Friedemann: 00:15:19

Okay, if I'm interested in either relay business or if I'm in the States, someone else, how can I help my business start moving in that direction?

Mario D'Elena: 00:15:29

It's actually true that most often someone reaches out that is already a bitcoiner, they are already in the leadership team.

Mario D'Elena: 00:15:39

But it has also happened that a business got consulted by someone and then they reached out together.

Mario D'Elena: 00:15:46

So this also happens.

Josh Friedemann: 00:15:48

I'd be interested to hear a Couple things from your background, you mentioned that you used to be in pensions.

Josh Friedemann: 00:15:53

First of all, maybe how did that influence either your understanding of Bitcoin or how does it help you communicate the value of Bitcoin to business owners or leadership team members when you're talking with them today?

Mario D'Elena: 00:16:08

As I said, I've been working for pension and in Switzerland, I don't know if all the listeners know, but we have a three pillar pension system and it's one of the best pension systems in the world.

Mario D'Elena: 00:16:18

And the good thing about it is that you actually start saving for your pension at the age of 16.

Mario D'Elena: 00:16:24

If you are working or at 21.

Mario D'Elena: 00:16:28

The latest start is at 21.

Mario D'Elena: 00:16:33

So I would say in Switzerland it's really ingrained in your mind that you have to save for your pension.

Mario D'Elena: 00:16:38

So that's already an easy introduction to Bitcoin because people know they must save.

Mario D'Elena: 00:16:44

They put a part, a part of their salary all the time.

Mario D'Elena: 00:16:49

Either mandatory ports like the first and the second pen pillar are mandatory.

Mario D'Elena: 00:16:53

And then there is a free port, a third pillar that also most juvenile people own.

Mario D'Elena: 00:17:00

So from there it's a really small step to get into Bitcoin because you can basically just say, well, ETFs which most solutions use have 10% performance.

Mario D'Elena: 00:17:14

And you look at Bitcoin and you see it had 60% per annum in the last four years.

Mario D'Elena: 00:17:21

So you can really get them already to DCA a small portion of their salary.

Josh Friedemann: 00:17:28

And when it comes to the pensions in Switzerland, I guess are these all funds that are run by the government or can you put your money wherever you'd like it to be?

Mario D'Elena: 00:17:41

So it is usually an institution.

Mario D'Elena: 00:17:44

Maybe the most well known is like AXA Insurance that runs a pension fund.

Mario D'Elena: 00:17:51

And that's where I've been working.

Mario D'Elena: 00:17:55

And so these are big institutions and not necessarily government run.

Josh Friedemann: 00:18:00

But I think it's very interesting that the mindset of anyone in your country starting at 16 is, hey, begin thinking about the future.

Josh Friedemann: 00:18:09

I'm imagining that really begins to set people up for success early on.

Mario D'Elena: 00:18:15

Absolutely.

Mario D'Elena: 00:18:16

And the issue that I had there is that of course the juvenile people use it already, but the people that are like 55 for example, and only have 10 years left, they were not so knowledgeable back in the years and didn't use all those pension savings.

Mario D'Elena: 00:18:31

And now if they want to catch up, a 10% performance with ETFs is just not enough.

Mario D'Elena: 00:18:36

And so the best solution for them obviously is Bitcoin.

Mario D'Elena: 00:18:40

And that's also where I had my issues because, because being a worker in pension, I could not tell them too much about bitcoin, and that's why I decided to leave that job, which was a really good one.

Mario D'Elena: 00:18:53

But I decided to go for the bitcoin solution.

Mario D'Elena: 00:18:57

I wanted to fully embrace bitcoin education, and that's why I'm a relationship manager today with Relay.

Josh Friedemann: 00:19:03

Excellent.

Josh Friedemann: 00:19:04

And then I'd love to hear a little bit more about what you do as far as your.

Josh Friedemann: 00:19:09

I guess you call it a dojo, whatever your business is for.

Josh Friedemann: 00:19:13

And I think you said karate, or maybe.

Josh Friedemann: 00:19:16

Maybe I just assumed karate.

Josh Friedemann: 00:19:17

What is the martial art that you practice and that you teach?

Mario D'Elena: 00:19:20

Yeah.

Mario D'Elena: 00:19:21

So I'm a traditional taekwondo teacher.

Mario D'Elena: 00:19:24

So this is Korean martial art, which is similar to karate.

Mario D'Elena: 00:19:28

So a lot of people, when they see us exercising, they think it's actually Shotokon karate, and think about it that way.

Mario D'Elena: 00:19:36

opened my school in September: 2020

Mario D'Elena: 00:19:42

And we are like, we have a really strong mindset, so we never closed our school.

Mario D'Elena: 00:19:47

We always went to exercise, but outside, which was still allowed in Switzerland.

Mario D'Elena: 00:19:52

You couldn't exercise inside, but outside was okay for adults, so everything went fine.

Mario D'Elena: 00:19:58

But of course, having bitcoin in your balance sheet gave you the peace of mind to actually create that school and.

Mario D'Elena: 00:20:08

And not worry too much about what you would get in.

Josh Friedemann: 00:20:13

was that when it was low, in: 2020

Josh Friedemann: 00:20:30

When did that piece begin to play into your business?

Mario D'Elena: 00:20:35

Of course, that makes a big difference when you cut it.

Mario D'Elena: 00:20:38

But I think still, at any point, if you have done it four years from, like, if you go four years backwards, at any point, you would still be profitable.

Mario D'Elena: 00:20:48

But it was in September: 2020

Mario D'Elena: 00:20:55

And from then on, I just put everything aside that I could create as earnings.

Mario D'Elena: 00:21:01

And funny enough, I was also profitable from the beginning, so I could DCA every month into bitcoin since then.

Mario D'Elena: 00:21:10

And as I said before, if you go to dcabtc.com, you can calculate four years backwards.

Mario D'Elena: 00:21:16

If you DCA from then, it's just 108% upside for your DCA plan, meaning you just double your earnings.

Mario D'Elena: 00:21:25

Or as I said before, translated into having twice the students or two schools or twice the employees.

Mario D'Elena: 00:21:34

I think this is an important point for every business to understand.

Josh Friedemann: 00:21:38

How do you think owning a business has helped you when it comes to talking with other Business owners at Relay Business.

Josh Friedemann: 00:21:42

Are there certain things that you're able to understand a little bit better or maybe things you're able to help them think through that may not be as obvious to other people because you've been in their shoes or you are in their shoes right now.

Mario D'Elena: 00:21:56

Exactly.

Mario D'Elena: 00:21:56

So for me, it's important to put your mouth, your money, where your mouth is.

Mario D'Elena: 00:22:03

So that's why I had to as a business, as a business consultant, I had to have a business to actually recommend it, else I couldn't say them.

Mario D'Elena: 00:22:14

Well, you should put it into your balance sheet.

Mario D'Elena: 00:22:16

And the same goes for Relay.

Josh Friedemann: 00:22:18

Right.

Mario D'Elena: 00:22:18

Relay also has bitcoin on its balance sheet.

Mario D'Elena: 00:22:21

So this is important for me to actually be honest with the clients because bitcoiners should be honest.

Mario D'Elena: 00:22:26

This is, it's ingrained in our being and that's for me personally it's important.

Mario D'Elena: 00:22:36

I don't think it helps me that much in an actual conversation.

Mario D'Elena: 00:22:41

Of course I can make some example out of my own business, but it's more important to really stand behind what you're doing.

Mario D'Elena: 00:22:49

So this gives you self confidence.

Josh Friedemann: 00:22:52

This may not be the easiest question to answer, but I'm curious to know if you either see because of information on the ground or just things that you theorize about the future when it comes to businesses and bitcoin, any trends you see, things you see developing things that you think will be normal in the next five to 10 years when it comes to businesses and bitcoin.

Mario D'Elena: 00:23:17

Yeah, just like social media part.

Mario D'Elena: 00:23:20

At the beginning, businesses were really reluctant to actually engage with social media.

Mario D'Elena: 00:23:27

But soon enough they understood that it actually doubles their earnings, it doubles their reach.

Mario D'Elena: 00:23:33

And I think the same thing goes for bitcoin.

Mario D'Elena: 00:23:36

So as soon as people start to understand that it's not just a financial tool but also a marketing tool that they can put their restaurant or whatever business they have on BTC Map and also get better known that.

Mario D'Elena: 00:23:48

I think that's, that's a great, a great point for.

Mario D'Elena: 00:23:52

I give you another example.

Mario D'Elena: 00:23:53

So we're looking for a hairdresser.

Mario D'Elena: 00:23:55

And if you're not happy with your actual hairdresser, you can go into BTC Map.

Mario D'Elena: 00:23:59

Look up if you have a hairdresser that actually accepts bitcoin.

Mario D'Elena: 00:24:04

And for me this translates into proficiency.

Mario D'Elena: 00:24:08

Like a person that is really knowledgeable about what he does uses bitcoin.

Mario D'Elena: 00:24:14

That's my assumption.

Josh Friedemann: 00:24:16

At the very least, I'm curious to know.

Josh Friedemann: 00:24:18

I don't actually disagree with that.

Josh Friedemann: 00:24:19

I would tend to actually agree with that.

Josh Friedemann: 00:24:23

But what leads you to say that that if they're accepting Bitcoin, you would assume that they are more proficient at what they're doing.

Mario D'Elena: 00:24:32

It subliminally tells you that a person has done the work about understanding Bitcoin.

Mario D'Elena: 00:24:39

Either be it someone has informed him or her about the topic or the work has been done by himself or herself.

Mario D'Elena: 00:24:48

So either you're open minded or you're hard working, but both are important points for being a good worker, a good employee, a good business leader.

Josh Friedemann: 00:25:00

So I don't mean to put you on the spot, but I'm genuinely curious.

Josh Friedemann: 00:25:04

Have you had many people come to you to learn Taekwondo because you accept Bitcoin?

Josh Friedemann: 00:25:10

Has that been a beneficial marketing tool for your own business?

Mario D'Elena: 00:25:13

That's a very good question.

Mario D'Elena: 00:25:15

So the truth is I just put it on BTC map myself.

Mario D'Elena: 00:25:19

I was not very open about putting it on the balance sheet, although I accepted also payments from my students.

Mario D'Elena: 00:25:27

balance sheet only in January: 2024

Mario D'Elena: 00:25:38

So a lot of people don't like when we post about BlackRock because it's an ETF, it's not self custody, it's not the ethos of Bitcoin.

Mario D'Elena: 00:25:47

But to be honest, before that BlackRock promoted the ESG narrative and now they're promoting Bitcoin.

Mario D'Elena: 00:25:53

And we have to think about what it does for bitcoin.

Mario D'Elena: 00:25:56

It makes it socially acceptable.

Mario D'Elena: 00:25:59

And in that point they changed the whole background of how bitcoin is seen from other people.

Mario D'Elena: 00:26:09

So now it's acceptable to put it on the balance sheet.

Mario D'Elena: 00:26:12

And so people say, ah, you accept bitcoin, okay, that's a good thing.

Josh Friedemann: 00:26:17

So one other thing that I think would be interesting to understand, I think important for business owners to think through is how to hold Bitcoin as a business.

Josh Friedemann: 00:26:29

You've already mentioned that relay doesn't hold the bitcoin for you.

Josh Friedemann: 00:26:32

That may be a temptation with certain exchanges.

Josh Friedemann: 00:26:36

But do you provide any services to help businesses get set up with self custody or at least any recommendations?

Josh Friedemann: 00:26:46

And if neither of those, then what do you tend to see?

Josh Friedemann: 00:26:51

Businesses who use relay business like how do they tend to hold their bitcoin?

Mario D'Elena: 00:26:55

So of course we emphasize to do code to use a cold wallet and some people are interested about multisig.

Mario D'Elena: 00:27:04

We will probably be announcing something soonish about that as well.

Mario D'Elena: 00:27:08

So we personally don't have a service that offers multi signature but we often get questions about this topic and we can point in certain directions but we don't do like tax services or multi signature.

Mario D'Elena: 00:27:24

Services.

Mario D'Elena: 00:27:25

So this is something we still have maybe on the roadmap, but right now we can't do that.

Mario D'Elena: 00:27:33

But of course we ask or recommend most people to use a cold wallet.

Mario D'Elena: 00:27:38

And we have also been working with Bitbox, so this is a usual go to for our clients.

Mario D'Elena: 00:27:45

But obviously a lot of people also use Trezor or Ledger or whichever cold wallet they would like.

Josh Friedemann: 00:27:52

Well, I appreciate you sharing all these things today.

Josh Friedemann: 00:27:55

It's great that you yourself are a small business owner and can speak from that perspective.

Josh Friedemann: 00:27:59

So I appreciate you sharing those thoughts today as well.

Josh Friedemann: 00:28:01

Do you have anything you'd like to leave the listeners with?

Josh Friedemann: 00:28:05

Whether it's particularly about bitcoin and business or something else, you just want to make sure listeners get before we finished up today's interview.

Mario D'Elena: 00:28:13

Sure.

Mario D'Elena: 00:28:14

So as I said before, I have a small business, I have a wife, three children.

Mario D'Elena: 00:28:22

So my question always is, if I would not go the bitcoin way, which way would you recommend me to use?

Mario D'Elena: 00:28:28

Because I can't see any other one.

Mario D'Elena: 00:28:33

So just to keep that in mind, think about that and where can people.

Josh Friedemann: 00:28:37

Go to keep up with Relay?

Josh Friedemann: 00:28:39

It sounds like there may be some announcements in the future, but if people just want to make sure they keep up with the latest on Relay or know what you're up to, where do you recommend that people go?

Mario D'Elena: 00:28:50

Yes, we're really active on LinkedIn, relay or my tag is Relay Business and you will find us on LinkedIn, on X, on every social media platform you find us on Nostr.

Mario D'Elena: 00:29:05

And I would say you can basically not miss us.

Mario D'Elena: 00:29:08

You will see us at any conference.

Mario D'Elena: 00:29:10

So the next one being Lugano, be sure to be there because we have two big announcements and yeah, I think for the next few weeks that's it.

Josh Friedemann: 00:29:20

Sounds good.

Josh Friedemann: 00:29:21

Well Mario, thank you so much for your time today.

Josh Friedemann: 00:29:23

It's been a pleasure.

Mario D'Elena: 00:29:24

Sure.

Mario D'Elena: 00:29:24

Thanks for having me.

Josh Friedemann: 00:29:26

Well friends, it's a wrap.

Josh Friedemann: 00:29:27

Thanks so much for listening to this episode of the Business Bitcoinization show.

Josh Friedemann: 00:29:31

If you want to reach out to either me or Mario, you find those links down in the show notes.

Josh Friedemann: 00:29:35

And if you know a business owner who could benefit from this episode, please share it with them.

Josh Friedemann: 00:29:39

As always, keep building, keep growing, and until next time, keep living and leading.

Josh Friedemann: 00:29:44

no waste, BTC signs and user: 129318

Josh Friedemann: 00:30:02

Be sure to use the Fountain app and when you listen, you very well could be earning some sats yourself, but you can support the show by either streaming sats as you listen or sending a boost.

Josh Friedemann: 00:30:11

And if you include a note with that boost, I'll be sure to read it on the show.